Bobbin Singh, founding Executive Director of the Oregon Justice Resource Center, discusses Oregon’s past and how that history influences its current policing response to protests and the prison system’s response to COVID-19, as well as calls on Oregon to recognize its past in order to transform its criminal legal system.
The path to justice will be different in each community. Founded in the late 1800s with a state constitution that specifically excluded Black Americans, Oregon’s current criminal justice system’s struggles are built on that legacy.
Our guest in this episode is Bobbin Singh, founding Executive Director of the Oregon Justice Resource Center. He discusses Oregon’s past and how that history influences its current policing response to protests and the prison system’s response to COVID-19, as well as calls on Oregon to recognize its past in order to transform its criminal legal system.
To learn more:
Oregon Justice Resource Center
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As a 501(c)(3) nonprofit organization, The Aspen Institute is nonpartisan and does not endorse, support, or oppose political candidates or parties. Further, the views and opinions of our guests and speakers do not necessarily reflect those of The Aspen Institute.
October 28, 2020
Copyright 2020 Aspen Institute Criminal Justice Reform Initiative
Announcer (00:00):
Welcome to this episode of Shades of Freedom, from the Aspen Institute's Criminal Justice Reform Initiative. This week's special guest is Bobbin Singh.
Bobbin Singh (00:10):
I think what COVID does is really expose the value system of this country, not just within the criminal justice system, but in all our social sectors. And I think has exposed the corruption of the value system that has existed, which is focused, I think, primarily on money and property, over the dignity of individuals.
Dr. Douglas E. Wood (00:32):
Welcome to Shades of Freedom. We are so pleased to have as our guest today, Bobbin Singh. Bobbin is Founding Executive Director of the Oregon Justice Resource Center, a nonprofit whose mission is to provide legal services to underserved groups, including those living in poverty and people of color. He argues that for individual rights to have any meaning, we must protect them for everyone without exception.
He founded the Oregon Justice Resource Center after graduating from law school in 2011. And believes that mass incarceration, including over-incarceration, mass conviction, and wrongful convictions, is the greatest civil rights crisis of our time.
Bobbin Singh, welcome to Shades of Freedom.
Bobbin Singh (01:12):
Thank you so much for having me.
Dr. Douglas E. Wood (01:14):
Bobbin, tell us how you got involved in this work. And how did you get from Atlanta to Oregon?
Bobbin Singh (01:20):
First, I'd have to say I was very much influenced by where I grew up and the culture of where I grew up. So I grew up in Atlanta, Georgia. My parents immigrated from India in the late 1960s. And I grew up in a Sikh household, so I wore a turban until I was 16 years old.
Bobbin Singh (01:36):
And I think, growing up in the south as a person of color in an immigrant community, I often experienced discrimination, prejudice, bigotry. My family was often threatened, harassed. And as a young person growing up, one of the things that I wanted to understand was how to cope with this. How do I navigate this culture? How do I navigate these types of experiences?
Bobbin Singh (02:00):
And the great thing about it, is Atlanta is the epicenter of the civil rights movement. And so we have all that history around us. And just so familiar with all the luminaries of that movement, like Dr. King, Andrew Young, Ralph Abernathy. So I didn't have to look very far for inspiration, or just my own education, in trying to understand what it is people could do to be able to push back, stand up, and fight for the dignity of having full participation and access.
Bobbin Singh (02:32):
And so, as I began to immerse myself into those experiences, I recognized that while those experiences were very different from my own experiences, that experiencing of othering was similar. And I think that stuck with me from a very, very early age, as far as these are not uncommon experiences, we do it quite often and quite regularly to different segments of our population. A lot of it based on race and ethnicity and religion and sexual orientation, whatever it may be. If you don't fit into the dominant culture paradigm, then you are somehow less than. And so I think that really shaped my formative years.
Bobbin Singh (03:10):
I started college in Atlanta. I initially attended Emory University and actually failed out. I didn't take it seriously. I had other personal issues going on with my own family. My father was very sick at that time and ended up passing away. I ended up moving out west to Oakland and living in Oakland for a couple years with friends. And then came up to Portland. And I was visiting colleges up here in Portland with my younger brother, and literally ran into Portland State University. I was jogging out in the city and was curious about it.
Bobbin Singh (03:39):
And Portland State University is a non-traditional commuter school. It has 30,000 students. And most of the students that are going there are older, second opportunities or second chance type students. People who have had varied life experiences. And so, for me, at that point in my life, it seemed less intimidating and an opportunity to get back into school. And so I tried, and I was successful. I ended up graduating with a degree, mostly focusing in on Middle East politics and history.
Bobbin Singh (04:08):
I ended up applying to law school and was able to get into Lewis & Clark Law School here in Oregon. And when I got into Lewis & Clark, it was pretty clear that I wanted to work on civil rights issues. I started looking for those opportunities. And at that time none of it really existed, at the law school, where students could work year-round.
Bobbin Singh (04:25):
A colleague and me decided to start partnering with local civil rights organizations and recruiting law students. And within a month or two, we had about 14 law students that were interested in working on these issues. And we just built out basically a quasi-externship program.
Bobbin Singh (04:40):
And when we graduated law school, job market wasn't that great and we decided to incorporate as a nonprofit and just build out the concept that we had developed. And over the past 10 years, because of both of our interests ... my interest primarily in criminal justice and civil rights ... we've just built out the OJRC into a public interest law firm that works on combating mass incarceration.
Bobbin Singh (05:03):
And I think it just goes back to the experiences that I had when I was young and then knowing, when I was in law school, these were the things that I wanted to work on. And I think the benefit of being in Oregon is that it's a smaller state. There's not an organization like this that already exists, so we weren't duplicating any efforts. So there was the space and opportunity for us to really build out something like this.
Bobbin Singh (05:24):
And over the last 10 years we now have a team of 20; 5 different statewide programs. But yeah, I think it's all motivated by and inspired by those civil right luminaries, by Stephen Bright from the Southern Center for Human Rights, which is based out of Atlanta, from Bryan Stevenson, and trying to replicate the work that they've done from a values perspective.
Dr. Douglas E. Wood (05:47):
Mm-hmm (affirmative). So tell us more about the work of the Oregon Justice Resource Center over these last 10 years?
Bobbin Singh (05:54):
Yeah. So for the past 10 years, I think what we've really identified in Oregon is that there has been a need for an organization to provide a perspective around criminal justice reform that was legally grounded or focused. And there was an absolute need for legal services for individuals going through the system who couldn't access legal services elsewhere, or it just wasn't available.
Bobbin Singh (06:18):
So the combination of the two is that we were able to build out a public interest law firm that provides legal services across five different projects. And we're the only legal organization in Oregon that actually is involved in all aspects of the criminal justice system, from arrest through reentry, in some capacity.
Bobbin Singh (06:36):
And what that really allows us to do is to give us a holistic or comprehensive view of what's happening in the criminal legal system and the experiences of individuals. And we really try to use the experiences of our clients to guide our systemic reform initiatives.
Dr. Douglas E. Wood (06:52):
Wow. There's so many things I could ask you about. Where do I start? Let's see. Well, let's start with conditions of confinement.
Bobbin Singh (07:01):
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Dr. Douglas E. Wood (07:03):
Can you tell us what was happening in prisons in Oregon and across the country at the beginning of the pandemic? And can you shed light on what is happening in detention centers, particularly for undocumented migrants?
Bobbin Singh (07:17):
Yeah. I think, prior to COVID, we were on a trajectory in this country in which mass incarceration and the issues of incarceration, including conditions of confinement, have really started penetrating the mainstream. Here in Oregon, I think we were really seeing our corrections department try to embrace new thinking and try to transform their institutions.
Bobbin Singh (07:43):
I think what we saw with COVID, is all that progress that we began to make, at least in rhetoric and even beginning to reshape the value, was halted. Here in Oregon, it felt like a wall went up. And what happened is the Corrections Department began to retract back inwards and become more insular, cutting off communication, cutting off access to individuals, denying individuals the ability to be able to access adequate hygiene, being able to provide those resources in a way that was free. There's been a lack of information and confusion. We've heard that individuals are afraid to access medical care because they're afraid of retaliation, or to admit that they have symptoms, COVID symptoms. So people don't want to be tested.
Bobbin Singh (08:26):
I think what COVID does has really exposed the value system of this country, not just within the criminal justice system, but in all our social sectors. And I think has exposed the corruption of the system that has existed, which is focused, I think, primarily on money and property, over the dignity of individuals. And I think what we see, is people retreat back into those core value systems or their natural instincts.
Bobbin Singh (08:52):
And what we saw with Corrections Department is that retreat back into, I think, what is their natural instincts, which is to dominate, control, be insular, be opaque. And I think that's unfortunate. Because what we've done, not only in Oregon, but in the country, is, I think, set ourselves up for a human rights catastrophe. And we're starting to see that play out in other states. And I think we have even less clarity and understanding of what's happening in immigration detention centers. Because the infrastructures and the oversight mechanisms that exist with them are far less than what we have with prisons. And there's very minimal, when we talk about prisons, to begin with.
Bobbin Singh (09:31):
So the unfortunate reality is, is I'm certain that what's being experienced by individuals in these immigration detention centers is probably horrific. I think the way in which we're treating individuals could potentially set up a dangerous precedent for future emergencies.
Dr. Douglas E. Wood (09:48):
Mm-hmm (affirmative). And can you say something about what's happening nationally, when it comes to COVID and conditions of confinement?
Bobbin Singh (09:55):
I think what we're seeing in Oregon is playing out across the country. I mean, each state has responded differently. It's like in Washington, which actually has a higher prison population than Oregon, has a less number of COVID cases and less deaths than Oregon. Which I think goes to show that even minimal actions, of releasing people and being committed to hygiene and trying to implement those practices early on, really paid off.
Bobbin Singh (10:20):
I think there's other states that we've seen, like the example in San Quentin, where once COVID gets into these prisons it can just rip through, causing unbelievable and profound damage. Most individuals that are in custody do have underlying health conditions. I mean, this is something that we have to confront as a country, but our prison population is aging. So we have a lot of individuals that are 50 and older, but by prison years that's much higher, they're much older than their known age.
Bobbin Singh (10:50):
And in Oregon we've had 16 deaths, due to COVID, in our prisons. I think almost every one of them have been individuals that are 50 or older. And that may have been only one or two individuals that were 50, but everyone else was, I think, above 60. And I think it's just incredibly unfortunate. Because, as a society, the amount that states have done in order to reorient their functions ... like in Oregon, the Governor's issued executive orders, most people are working from home, most people aren't going to schools. The amount of effort that we've taken to protect ourselves, none of that's been paralleled in our prisons. In fact, we have done almost the exact opposite. All the things that we've done as a society, we're not doing in our prisons. That contrast is sharp. And I think it's playing out similarly, pretty much in every state.
Dr. Douglas E. Wood (11:41):
Bobbin, what happens to returning citizens who have been released as a result of the pandemic? I often say that prisons and jails are inextricably tied to communities. Are they receiving comprehensive reentry supports when they get back?
Bobbin Singh (11:57):
I think it's mixed. I mean, the Department of Corrections here does do some reentry planning with individuals. I think it's minimal. And then I think it just depends on the county that you're returning to and the support systems that you already have in place.
Bobbin Singh (12:11):
But I think, generally speaking, no. I think we're caught in this vicious circle where we have now COVID in our prisons, and then people are being exposed to that and that's impacting how they're able to reenter and return into the community. Because they will have to spend some time either quarantining when they get out, which they're not informed of. There may not be transitional homes or housing available for individuals because of COVID, because they just may not be able to physically social distance at some of the reentry housing places that exist.
Bobbin Singh (12:46):
And then what we also see is a demand for services. I mean, I think, here in Oregon, we not only had COVID but we had the wildfires as well. And that's really began to put a lot of pressures on the social services that exist for individuals, just broadly speaking.
Bobbin Singh (13:01):
And so I think what we're seeing is not only a failure in our treatment of individuals while they're in custody, but I think a pretty large societal failure in our ability to be able to really support people that are coming out. And it's not to say that people aren't coming out with support systems or there aren't volunteer groups out there that are helping. But I think, collectively speaking, we'll see a diversity of experience across states and across counties.
Bobbin Singh (13:28):
But by and large, I think our understanding in our conversations with individuals is that it's confusing, it's stressful. People are unclear about the supports that are available. And then we've heard of individuals that have come out of prison, and that week there's some reentry homes that will test them for COVID and they're testing positive immediately. Which means they were positive in prison, likely. And so that's a bigger problem, if people are returning back into the community, positive, as counties or communities are trying to flatten the curve.
Bobbin Singh (13:59):
So I think that's one of the most important things that advocates across this country have been trying to emphasize, is that by actually being aggressive and being responsive to those in custody, we're actually protecting the community. That it's to our benefit, for us that are on the outside, to actually be very serious about what we do and how we respond.
Dr. Douglas E. Wood (14:22):
Mm-hmm (affirmative). I'm going to switch a little bit. But, of course, all of this is connected.
Dr. Douglas E. Wood (14:26):
You mentioned earlier about law enforcement. And, on occasion, you've talked a bit about how some law enforcement agencies view right-wing groups. So what are your thoughts about that, first? And how can this issue be addressed in ways where law enforcement can work in tandem with communities to promote safety and justice?
Bobbin Singh (14:49):
Oh, yeah. I mean, that's another huge issue that we're dealing with here in Oregon. Because of Oregon's history, it was an exclusion state, it entered the union where it prohibited black people from living in Oregon, had one of the largest KKK populations per capita here in Oregon in the 1920s. All of that original sin of white supremacy that this country was built on, Oregon was built on. And all that's carried over into our culture and practices and policies. And we've never actually confronted that. And I think it plays out most extremely in our law enforcement practices and our law enforcement culture.
Bobbin Singh (15:24):
I mean, what we've seen here in Oregon, especially since Donald Trump became president, far-right groups have increased their presence, their rhetoric, and their activity here in Portland and in the Northwest generally. This has always been a hub for white nationalist groups and far-right groups.
Bobbin Singh (15:42):
What we've also experienced is that, because they're co-opting these pro law enforcement symbols, much of our law enforcement, even in Portland, lives outside of the Portland area and in these areas in which these groups come from. We see that law enforcement typically views these groups as more mainstream, or more similar to their own thinking. And what we've experienced, especially over the past four years, is biased law enforcement practices.
Bobbin Singh (16:07):
So we see local law enforcement use brutal and violent tactics against Black Lives Matter protestors, protesters that have been protesting against Trump, racial justice protesters, people who have been protesting against authoritarianism. And what we see, by and large, law enforcement taking a very kind approach with far-right groups. So there's often more correspondence or some coordination with law enforcement. We have never really seen law enforcement use tear gas or any type of violence against far-right groups. In protests, what we've seen is police typically having their backs to far-right groups, facing Black Lives Matter protestors or racial justice protestors.
Bobbin Singh (16:50):
And so all this is indicative of a culture that has existed within our local law enforcement here in Oregon, which is that it is, at best, center-right. But I think a lot of these individuals do believe or relate to the ideology of these far-right groups or these militia groups that are coming into town. And the confluence of both having to try to have a conversation about police accountability, and the far-right, we're seeing the overlap between the two. I mean, they are definitely, in many ways, distinct issues, but in many ways issues that cannot be disconnected from each other.
Dr. Douglas E. Wood (17:29):
Mm-hmm (affirmative). Mm-hmm (affirmative). And then what are your thoughts about how this issue can be addressed in ways where law enforcement can work in tandem with communities to promote safety and justice?
Bobbin Singh (17:40):
I don't have a very good answer to that, except that I think my first instinct is that we have to disband our local law enforcement, like the Portland Police Bureau, and rebuild and reimagine what public safety and law enforcement is and what the role of public safety and law enforcement officers are. And that's going to take a lot of work.
Bobbin Singh (17:59):
I think part of that also is connected to this idea of truth and reconciliation. I'm such a big fan of Bryan Stevenson and how he talks about this. I try to listen to him as much as I can and then I will co-opt, into my own talking points, his eloquence. I just think he does a brilliant job.
Bobbin Singh (18:20):
But he talks about truth and reconciliation being this sequential process, that we have to be truthful and honest about this white supremacist history that has dominated this country and the manifestations of that, from slavery, to segregation, the racial terror through lynching, again, to this most recent evolution of mass incarceration and the criminal legal system being used as a way of creating social and racial hierarchy.
Bobbin Singh (18:47):
And I think, as a state, unless we're willing to actually confront our own history in Oregon honestly, unless we're really willing to confront how that history has impacted our current practices and policy and how law enforcement has evolved from that history, we'll never actually get to solutions that will mean anything. And we actually won't even understand what the solutions are unless we're honest about that problem.
Bobbin Singh (19:15):
So I think, as a community, it's a complicated conversation that requires multiple jurisdictions, city, county, and state, to be in dialogue with the community and to have this more open conversation. And then I think the solutions will reveal themselves, once we're able to honestly confront that history.
Bobbin Singh (19:35):
I think, unfortunately, what we're seeing right now, is city, county, and state leaders wanting to bypass or shortcut this truth process and go straight to things of reconciliation. So they're offering concepts for reforms, ideas, as a way to try to address racial justice, but not actually ever addressing their own complicitness in how their own offices or how their own agencies may have been complicit in sustaining these harms. And I think that's going to be a failure.
Bobbin Singh (20:07):
So I really do think we, as a country, and as a state, and a community, have to go through that truth and reconciliation process.
Dr. Douglas E. Wood (20:14):
Mm-hmm (affirmative). And you've answered this in many ways, but I just want to go a little bit deeper on that. Prior to, and now, during the COVID crisis, many advocates have called not just for criminal justice reform, but criminal justice transformation that addresses and takes into consideration these wider connected issues, such as education, housing, healthcare, employment, where transformation is grounded in community self-determination, around safety and justice.
Dr. Douglas E. Wood (20:44):
What would it take to transform the system that is community-centered? And what could be done in the short-term and long-term to make that kind of transformation a reality?
Bobbin Singh (20:55):
As a colleague mentioned to me, we get the opportunity to plant a seed so the next generation can enjoy the shade of the tree. And what I mean by that, is that all the rights and liberties that I think that are enshrined in our constitution, I don't know that we'll be able to enjoy that in our generation, but I think we get the opportunity to help create a vision of this country that's never existed. And, to me, that's exciting. People talk about the intensity of this time and how much is going on. But I look at this as a moment for us to be able to help change the trajectory of this country.
Bobbin Singh (21:33):
And I think, in the short-term, what really allows us to be able to navigate through this, I think it's continued pushing, continued protest, continued forcing the conversation, continue to make sure that we keep our focus on white supremacy, this root ideology that created this country, and how do we begin a process of dismantling that?
Bobbin Singh (21:56):
When I look back at the civil rights movement and the luminaries that help push that, from the '40s on through the '60s, what inspires me about those individuals is that they took that opportunity, they looked at it as a moment to be able to participate in a conversation and to be able to stand up for values and to help change the trajectory of American culture, systems and politics.
Bobbin Singh (22:23):
One of the things that I believe people are beginning to understand, is all of this was created by humans. We can change any of this at any time we want. None of this is static. None of this is determined or predetermined in any way. And all of this was created by individuals that came before us, which means we can easily change this, if we decide to do that, and reorient our value system.
Bobbin Singh (22:48):
I think, in the long run, it's going to take complexity and us embracing complexity, and not being afraid of nuance and having conversations that scare us and push us in places that are completely uncomfortable. And there's nothing more uncomfortable, for most people, than talking about racism and white supremacy.
Bobbin Singh (23:09):
So I think the first thing is getting people to be comfortable with the idea that this country was founded and developed on a system of racial hierarchy and social hierarchy, and that we have to undo that. And undoing 200 years plus of infrastructure, political culture, social culture, it's not easy and it'll take, I think, a while to do it. But I really think that we can. And I think we have to keep using that language of transformation, that this is not about reform but this is really about transformation. And I think we have to be very clear about what it is that we're striving to achieve.
Dr. Douglas E. Wood (23:48):
So when you hear the words, shades of freedom, what does that mean to you now and into the future?
Bobbin Singh (23:56):
This is really interesting, because this was messing with me this past week, ever since you reach out and we began talking about this. And then when you mentioned Higginbotham's book, I went and looked at it.
Bobbin Singh (24:11):
And it's such a provocative and interesting phrase, because I think it has so much dimension and layers to it. I think, right now, for me, that term really highlights the fact that each and every one of us in this country are enjoying different levels of freedom, that we all have different shades of freedom that we're experiencing. And we haven't been honest about that. And I think we have tried to mask that up by saying, "Oh, racism doesn't exist," or, "We're living in a colorblind society," or, "The civil rights movement happened," or, "These are economic issues, not racial issues," or what have you.
Bobbin Singh (24:48):
But I think, first, we have to be honest about the fact that not everybody gets the same amount of access or privileges or rights in this country, and that that's intentional. And once we see that, then we can begin to really think about: how do we make people whole in this community? How do we begin to work on ensuring that everybody can live a life of dignity? And I think that's really what that phrase is hitting home with me right now.
Dr. Douglas E. Wood (25:14):
Thank you so much, Bobbin. It's been so great to have you on. We're so pleased to hear about the great work you're doing with the Oregon Justice Resource Center, and your thoughts about what's happening today and into the future. Thanks a lot.
Bobbin Singh (25:27):
Thank you so much for having me.
Announcer (25:31):
Thanks for joining us for Shades of Freedom, a new podcast from the Aspen Institute's Criminal Justice Reform Initiative. We'll be back soon with more thought provoking guests working to transform the criminal justice system and beyond.
Announcer (25:46):
Our initiative is supported by Arnold Ventures, the Bank of America Charitable Foundation, Ascendium Education Group, and Google. You can find out more about the Aspen Criminal Justice Reform Initiative, read our recent reports, blogs, view videos, and join our email list at aspeninstitute.org/CJRI, or follow us on Twitter, @AspenCjri.